Potential Carambor Fix

All discussion of candidate rules for errata; open to non-members.
Vastor Peredhil
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Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by Vastor Peredhil » Tue Mar 29, 2011 8:43 am

Honetly, Carambor is basically the only "real trick deck" within the top tier decks, and it is the only deck, which does not offer an opponent "any turn or just 1 turn" at all (if done correctly), so it is beyond any other top tier decks.

An oppponent might be bored to death by Mordor Shuffle or Black(Purple) Hills or Wolfiegast, but at least they get 1-4 turn to prove their own skills on the resource part (or lack there of)

Caramber FW Shortrest does not allow opponent any way to deal with unless the hazards are able to deal with it, but it needs preparation and we have to keep people in the game "not frustrate the fuck out of them" with this deck.

Top tier games are not my type, but allow for a fix that needs one, or we have less players for these top events

yours Nicolai

miguel
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Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by miguel » Tue Mar 29, 2011 9:08 am

My biggest beef with the Carambor-machine is that it totally screws one alignment, Hero. There really isn't anything a hero player can do, short of packing 3x Ire and 3x Blind straight in the deck and hoping for the best... The smartest thing a player can do when suspecting the Carambor-machine will be present, is to not play Hero! And that's really bad...

I know the Carambor-machine extremely well, and feel the best way to deal with it is simply banning Carambor from FW-decks. The proposed errata might hinder 'normal' Carambor decks that are still quite cheezy, but does very little to the machine (moving from haven to haven in Arthedain). No errata necessary, just ban the sucker. [-me_ccc-]

Bandobras Took
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Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by Bandobras Took » Tue Mar 29, 2011 1:30 pm

That's a good point; it's no more than Kill All or the Windlord Found Me being unusable by FWs.
Remember, NetRep rulings are official. This does not necessarily mean they are correct.

You probably aren't playing Fallen Wizards correctly.

marcos
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Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by marcos » Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:26 pm

Caramber FW Shortrest does not allow opponent any way to deal with unless the hazards are able to deal with it, but it needs preparation and we have to keep people in the game "not frustrate the fuck out of them" with this deck.
Don't mix up the decks, using carambor to get advantage from short rest is not the same as using Carambor-machine to exhaust twice

marcos
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Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by marcos » Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:34 pm

Unique. Once per turn, Carambor may tap at the end of his company's movement/hazard phase to allow it to move to an additional site on the same turn. Another site card may be played and another movement/hazard phase immediately follows for his company. The new site path must contain at least one Wilderness.
Bolds are mine.
I think i heard this proposal from someone else but since nobody has posted it already, i bring it for discussion. It will break the exhaust machine but it won't kill the other uses he might have for a FW like taking advantage from short rest or reaching almost any part of the map in one turn.

thoughts?

miguel
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Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by miguel » Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:46 pm

Works for me! :D

Bandobras Took
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Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by Bandobras Took » Mon Apr 04, 2011 12:48 pm

I like it.
Remember, NetRep rulings are official. This does not necessarily mean they are correct.

You probably aren't playing Fallen Wizards correctly.

Vastor Peredhil
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Location: Kempen (Niederrhein) Germany

Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by Vastor Peredhil » Mon Apr 04, 2011 1:08 pm

Ok, do it that way then ;)

once a turn could still be useful enough in most decks

Jose-san
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Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by Jose-san » Tue Apr 05, 2011 8:00 am

Too restrictive to my taste. Maybe I don't understand the Carambor machine fully. Why not issue errata for Here Is a Snake!instead, so it only lasts until the end of the current M-H phase?

Bandobras Took
Rules Wizard
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Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by Bandobras Took » Tue Apr 05, 2011 12:33 pm

Because then we would also have to fix Spying Out the Land. By fixing Carambor, it's only one card, not two.
Remember, NetRep rulings are official. This does not necessarily mean they are correct.

You probably aren't playing Fallen Wizards correctly.

marcos
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Joined: Sun Feb 18, 2007 5:41 pm
Location: Córdoba, Argentina

Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by marcos » Tue Apr 05, 2011 12:43 pm

Besides that, the combo can also work with elf path, stealth, sneakin, spying out the land, ford, etc...
We can't/shouldn't errata all those :)

miguel
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Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:21 am

Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by miguel » Wed Apr 06, 2011 1:25 pm

Jose-san wrote:Too restrictive to my taste. Maybe I don't understand the Carambor machine fully. Why not issue errata for Here Is a Snake!instead, so it only lasts until the end of the current M-H phase?
The only card you need to draw for the machine is Washed and Refreshed or Healing of Nimrodel, then Carambor can keep running between Weathertop [-me_ha-] (Hidden Havened at draft) and The White Towers [-me_ha-] via Arthedain [-me_wi-] . The other cards mentioned above are just gravy; they help but are certainly not necessary for the machine to work.

Once the machine is up and running, the moves are relatively safe. Carambor is teamed up with a magic user, so his company gets benefits such as 20x Bitter Cold to help with the final move(s)... :lol:

dirhaval
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Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by dirhaval » Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:34 am

I have not played or witnessed this elf version of Flash.

I like the addition, mentioned earlier, of once per turn.
Or make him 7 mind. Hendolen can control this pesky W/Sc/R with Trifling Ring.
However, a 7 mind elf will limit a Fallen-wizard somewhat. I like to use the elf
to quickly over the Misty Mountains into Mordor.

Cannot not Chance at Being Lost, Scorba at Home, Exile of Solitude, and Tidings of Bold Spies get the _________?

Logain
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Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by Logain » Mon Dec 11, 2017 3:49 pm

So, do we do anything at all ? I propose to hold a poll :
1. Once per turn,
2. 7 mind.
3. Just ban him.
4. Do nothing, it's nice to play against a guy who plays alone.

(and validate 4 only if it has more votes than the other options).

I warned ICE in 1998 about this combo, they banned it on the spot (french nationals 1998). Looks like players like Sauron made them change their mind afterwards.

Vastor Peredhil
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Re: Potential Carambor Fix

Post by Vastor Peredhil » Mon Dec 11, 2017 4:09 pm

there might be other options as well, but once per turn or 7 mind seems the way to go

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