Many formats good or bad.

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Do you think different game formats are good for Meccg?

Yes, new ways to play this game help to keep comunity together.
17
68%
No, to many different formats toss the comunity apart.
8
32%
 
Total votes: 25

zirilan
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Many formats good or bad.

Post by zirilan » Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:14 pm

Hello fellow players,

one night in gccg I had an interessting topic with marcos.
Let me start at the very beginning. Yet another night
marcos came home from work and wanted to play a
game of general opponent but found once again, noone
who wanne play. It was far not the 1st night we saw that.
Thats how our discussion started.

Marcos thinks, that too many different game formats
(VC, DC, sealed, Cool Play, Dragon Hunt, etc.) let the
normal game wipe out. The few remaining players with
Meccg cards stop playing GO and thats what it let die out.
(correct me if I am not exactly enough here marcos)

While I think, that many formats keep players involved
with the game. If only GO would be played, I would have
long stoped playing Meccg at all (like it happend to other
trading card games I played). I do not favor all formats, no,
but still they keep people involved, they might be lost to
GO but not lost to Meccg at all, you can still contact them.

Much text, but I think that is worth a discussion.

Greetings Alex

marcos
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Re: Many formats good or bad.

Post by marcos » Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:45 pm

The fact is that many people only plays specific formats, so finding an opponent to play with is extremely difficult.

While i think we both are right somehow, how is it useful to keep the community together with various formats if noone of the players can play a game because they all play different formats? I know i have met a lot of friends thanks to meccg and while i enjoy meeting with them, i also like playing the game which is what i barely do right now because of this.

zirilan
Posts: 348
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Location: c:\

Re: Many formats good or bad.

Post by zirilan » Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:08 am

I was curious about some thoughts on this.
To have a poll result is nice, but we would like to discuss this a bit if possible.

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Makinal
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Location: Osorno, Chile

Re: Many formats good or bad.

Post by Makinal » Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:20 am

we are lucky to have gccg, if someone just plays sealed so be it. there are players for all the formats, i personally try to adapt to the options available. some people dont like sealed games, some people dont like dc games, even there's people dont like to play "competitive"(i mean they just like to play for fun and dont like when playing against someone who would whoop his ass at the end of the 4th turn) games.

There's an audience for every format and we should be happy. my two cents

marcos
Posts: 2010
Joined: Sun Feb 18, 2007 5:41 pm
Location: Córdoba, Argentina

Re: Many formats good or bad.

Post by marcos » Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:40 am

Makinal wrote:we are lucky to have gccg, if someone just plays sealed so be it. there are players for all the formats, i personally try to adapt to the options available. some people dont like sealed games, some people dont like dc games, even there's people dont like to play "competitive"(i mean they just like to play for fun and dont like when playing against someone who would whoop his ass at the end of the 4th turn) games.

There's an audience for every format and we should be happy. my two cents
that is the main problem, there isnt an audience like you say. every time i want to play a regular game i dont see anyone making a step forward. And it is not my own thougts, Alex himself mentioned in the posts above that such situation gets repeated day after day.

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Makinal
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Re: Many formats good or bad.

Post by Makinal » Wed Nov 21, 2012 3:18 pm

if i want to play, and someone just play sealed I play sealed, or dc, i play dc, o just a friendly match i play. maybe that's why i see it that way

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Thorsten the Traveller
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Re: Many formats good or bad.

Post by Thorsten the Traveller » Wed Nov 21, 2012 10:43 pm

There seems to be a distinction in players along 2 dimensions/variables, which partly overlap.
1. Those who like meccg as a challenge, and those who like it as a comfortable old jacket.
2. Those who like a competitive game, and those who like a cool thematic (social) game.

For both variables the following applies: the formats follow the players, not the other way round. If you only had GO, a number of people would either leave the game, or simply avoid competitive players (in casual games). You cannot change people by having fewer formats.

That being said, I do believe we should make efforts to bring different types of players together. In my opinion, meccg is not at its best as competitive game, the wealth of cards is then sorely underused. Even so, it would be great if we could make GO more interesting for other players. I would have very much liked it if VC and DC could accomplish that. But then we run into the problem of nr.1: most competitive players do not like or will not accept changes. They like the game because they know exactly what to expect. They have no energy to delve into new stuff, and have forgotten the excitement of the earlier meccg days. So imo the problem lies there, and it's difficult to solve. Because the scene is small, and neither set of players should want to determine the type of fun for the other. But if both set of players are willing to make a step, it should be possible. For example, I'm willing to play a GO game if opponent accepts dcff cards (and normal rules, though dc rules are better of course :-)

So, I choose option C: the formats reflect the different players, and neither split nor bring them closer.
Stone-age did not end because man ran out of rocks.

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Bandobras Took
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Re: Many formats good or bad.

Post by Bandobras Took » Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:34 pm

Many of the different formats (other than the obvious DC exception) came about, in my mind, because of an almost unbelievable refusal to ameliorate the playing environment by actually modifying tournament rules, which are also the standard for GCCG.

I haven't signed on to GCCG in a long time because of RL concerns (I used to be a regular w/Marcos), but also because of something that is unutterably my own fault: learning the rules well enough to know all the ways in which the game is simply mechanically nonfunctional. Further efforts like the already (finally) implemented change to the auto-attack rule would draw me back, but by the time we get ten such errata (I can think of any number of topics that need addressing), I'm going to be over sixty before they all are finished at the current rate.

The last thing I attempted to participate in (and had to withdraw from because of the aforementioned RL) was the DC Playtest. I participated in it because the only section of the game that I see undergoing actual and constant improvement is the DC area. Eventually, a broken game stops being constant fun, and that is the problem that has plagued GO for over a decade now.
Remember, NetRep rulings are official. This does not necessarily mean they are correct.

You probably aren't playing Fallen Wizards correctly.

emux
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2012 6:56 pm

Re: Many formats good or bad.

Post by emux » Fri Nov 23, 2012 10:25 am

Hi!

I would like to give my humble opinion as a noob in this game for this topic. After many years of being shelved this game, i went back and meet a
lot of new cards and rules i dont know.

Is a bit frustrating at first, especially if you play against skilled people.

I personally like to play the official rules of ICE when I play with official cards, but that doesn't mean ill look forward for new challenges and add
more variety to my game with new rules and cards (Cool play, Drunk, Sealed, DC, etc)

What if I miss and hope it's not that I have not looked well, is to find a site where i can find those rules, examples, information and unify of the different rules (not just of the Universal Rules that appear on this forum which I think the work excelent or the part of rules that exist in the CoE website) game, typos, etc. and easily accessible, not only in a lost folder in the project core CGCG (metw), in some outdated web or the sulfur-deeps [-me_dh-] .

That said, I voted to keep as much as possible the unified rules (any kind even new rules) because I believe many difficult access rules will keep many people away from this wonderful game.

Taurelin
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Re: Many formats good or bad.

Post by Taurelin » Sun Nov 25, 2012 11:48 am

I see the variety of formats as a good thing. Of course, it doesn't mean that the number of people playing a particular format (like GO, for example) increases. But it gives people a choice, keeps people interested in the game in the first place, and makes it possible to run events like LURE. And this is a positive thing for each format.
"My sky is darker than thine!"
SENTENCED - 1993

Pikachu
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Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2008 1:55 pm
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Re: Many formats good or bad.

Post by Pikachu » Wed Nov 28, 2012 11:14 am

For me, I can confirm what has already been written.

I have a full set of cards, am willing to spend money on the game, follow discussions about it, but still: I am put off by the "technical" aspect of the rules and the "competetive" play (as defined above). I want to play the game, and most of the effective tactics for winning do not match with my definition of playing - I am aware that a lot of players see this totally different :)

But that's the reason why me and my friend (with a huge collection of cards) do not mingle with the MECCG scene, we keep to ourselves and play the way we like it.

Lake Town Geezer
Posts: 46
Joined: Wed Oct 02, 2013 12:09 pm

Re: Many formats good or bad.

Post by Lake Town Geezer » Mon Oct 07, 2013 4:13 pm

I think there is a need for improved solo game rules. I am working on this myself.

Many players too isolated to play for real, so solo rules with interesting fast play variants could help keep the game alive.

dirhaval
Posts: 573
Joined: Tue Feb 06, 2007 5:39 am

Re: Many formats good or bad.

Post by dirhaval » Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:26 pm

Hi. I like to add my pennies.
Some of you know of the FATE project I am doing. Yes, 40 individuals playing at once
is impossible, but it does show the flavor of MECCG.

Why not ask an opponent. "Tell me what will be your main source of MP?"
You then say. "I plan to use many dwarves and play a Dwarven Ring."
You then ask. "Tell me the generally site types or map location you will use?"

Then you can tailor the hazards and game play to that. It will be a new challenge.
Don't be surprise if I begin a game inquiry with you on GCCG as above.

One more thing. Why not say to your opponent, "I will play at least 10 under-deep MP"
before I call the game. What is your plan? Why not?
Or place restrictions on cards in the deck such as at least 50% of the resource cards are different from another card
so you do not play all 3-copies of non-uniques.

How about two players play different scenarios? It might be unbalance for a while but you will get a hang of it, then
post your results here. I like to see them.
Why not start the game after a game? FATE has you build a new deck after the first deck.
Say, " Lets start each with 32 mind of characters in play, 20MP of resources, each source requiring on average one other card (magic ring needs two cards normally: test and gold ring item; I know about Gandalf, but normally okay :) and say total CP of your items is less than 15? or 2 greater, 3 major, and.....
Then set a goal?
Yes, I do not know how one can do that on GCCG though.
If you can trust your opponent use customize spreadsheets like I use including random #, Word file to show cards in the hand, list of cards in the hand and so on.
You will communicate what you play.
Look! I found a shilling.

Lake Town Geezer
Posts: 46
Joined: Wed Oct 02, 2013 12:09 pm

Re: Many formats good or bad.

Post by Lake Town Geezer » Tue Oct 15, 2013 10:02 am

I like the idea of the FATE rules. They suggest to me something else (I dont know if this exists);

Imagine if 40 diff players could all have to play by slightly different rules?

For example, if I was playing as 'Elrond' there might be three rules especially for me: i) I cannot play a wizard ii) I am the only one who can play the Elrond Hero resource iii) I have three Vilya hero resource in my play deck. other cards assigned are normal for a hero player.

This would be cool - imagine you have 40 different roles in a game, and you take on one role - these could be the roles of the powers in ME e.g.

The 5 wizards (Saruman as a fallen wizard), the nine Nazgul, the three Elf lords, Sauron, Thranduil, Tom Bombadil (played as a character not an ally), Balrog (1 x Moria + 1 x Angmar), Beorn, ...

Well, there are 22 anyway..

This would be a fun, massive game.

maybe something like this has been at LURE?

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